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Olympian2 27-12-2021 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystaljim (Post 16176631)
The crowd getting behind them like that reminded me of going to tests as a youngster with Lillee and Thommo in action! :p

Whoever one supports, there’s something wonderful about a fast bowler running in with a new cherry at the end of a day’s play, among the lengthening shadows, shattering stumps… :p

RazorsEdge 27-12-2021 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystaljim (Post 16176631)
The crowd getting behind them like that reminded me of going to tests as a youngster with Lillee and Thommo in action! :p

I read somewhere the crowd were pouring beer into their shoes and onto their heads and calling it shooey.

If (a big if) there was no covid I would have been there with the Barmy Army

Jordan's Jacket 27-12-2021 01:21 PM

Classy

Philipw 27-12-2021 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuieJack (Post 16176634)
Could not disagree with your sentiments, as the simple fact is we are in the mire when looking ahead unless wholesome change happens. But sadly how often have we said this after returning from being humilated after a tour, so will this time be any different?
I said yesterday we need to replace the clueless Silverwood with hopefully Gillespie for starters, take away the captaincy from Root and let him focus on what he does best, then somehow find a capable Opening pair which seems like mission impossible, then somehow try to replace the irresistable pair of Anderson and Broad, oh i nearly forgot find a spinner who can actually get the ball to spin.
How we achieve all of this when looking at the County scene only heaven knows:( but we must before we travel to India, NZ and Australia again to save further humilation.:rolleyes:


Much though I like the county championship, I think Pietersen has it right on this. Despite always having 17 or 18 teams diluting talent, it has created test batsmen in the past as pretty well all the best overseas players played in it. Potential test players will have played against the best bowlers in the world on a regular basis before even playing a test match. The overseas players no longer need to play in the CC now as they can earn loads more from T20 comps so we are left with just the English players - and not even the test players. In the other countries I think all the domestic talent is concentrated in around six teams and therefore more likely to face higher quality bowling against which to learn your trade.

Wolfnipplechips 27-12-2021 03:39 PM

On reflection I think we should open with Benteke and Ayew.

Big Blue Eagle 27-12-2021 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RazorsEdge (Post 16176672)
I read somewhere the crowd were pouring beer into their shoes and onto their heads and calling it shooey.

If (a big if) there was no covid I would have been there with the Barmy Army

Itís a general Aussie thing, Danny Ricciardo does it on the podium with champagne.

RazorsEdge 27-12-2021 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Blue Eagle (Post 16177073)
Itís a general Aussie thing, Danny Ricciardo does it on the podium with champagne.

It does sound gross, but each to their own

Olympian2 27-12-2021 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RazorsEdge (Post 16176672)
I read somewhere the crowd were pouring beer into their shoes and onto their heads and calling it shooey.

They do that at T20 Finals Day. I refer to them as 'cricket dickheads'.

LuieJack 27-12-2021 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philipw (Post 16176679)
Much though I like the county championship, I think Pietersen has it right on this. Despite always having 17 or 18 teams diluting talent, it has created test batsmen in the past as pretty well all the best overseas players played in it. Potential test players will have played against the best bowlers in the world on a regular basis before even playing a test match. The overseas players no longer need to play in the CC now as they can earn loads more from T20 comps so we are left with just the English players - and not even the test players. In the other countries I think all the domestic talent is concentrated in around six teams and therefore more likely to face higher quality bowling against which to learn your trade.

There are many factors to consider Philip, I also agree with a lot of what you say. But with so many different formats today which can hinder the development/growth of young players becoming potential Test players, unfortunately there is also a derth of young talent coming through in England that is capable of making the step up to Test level as say they have in India, Pakistan and Australia.
Maybe it is just a question of the ones that have come through are just not as good as we thought and are seeing, whatever those reasons are but we know it is going to need a good rethink at the top if they are to stop the rot.

Wolfnipplechips 27-12-2021 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuieJack (Post 16177153)
There are many factors to consider Philip, I also agree with a lot of what you say. But with so many different formats today which can hinder the development/growth of young players becoming potential Test players, unfortunately there is also a derth of young talent coming through in England that is capable of making the step up to Test level as say they have in India, Pakistan and Australia.
Maybe it is just a question of the ones that have come through are just not as good as we thought and are seeing, whatever those reasons are but we know it is going to need a good rethink at the top if they are to stop the rot.

A number of our batters have regressed. Iím not sure having Ramprakash coaching them was ever going to be the right move.

Pope, Crawley and dare I say it Burns have struggled, Bairstow, Buttler and others such as Hameed, Duckett and Bracey were never good enough anyway.

Malan is showing signs of promise but the cupboard is bare.

crystaljim 27-12-2021 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfnipplechips (Post 16177165)
A number of our batters have regressed. I’m not sure having Ramprakash coaching them was ever going to be the right move.

Pope, Crawley and dare I say it Burns have struggled, Bairstow, Buttler and others such as Hameed, Duckett and Bracey were never good enough anyway.

Malan is showing signs of promise but the cupboard is bare.

Are you better off with Burns Bairstow opening, Haseeb or Crawley at 3 and Malan at 5? Or Bairstow at 3. If these are your best options, perhaps start to build a batting order around them that works.
Open with 2 experienced guys, one of the kids at 3, then Rooty. Malan can then be more attacking at 5.

Philipw 27-12-2021 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfnipplechips (Post 16177165)
A number of our batters have regressed. I’m not sure having Ramprakash coaching them was ever going to be the right move.

Pope, Crawley and dare I say it Burns have struggled, Bairstow, Buttler and others such as Hameed, Duckett and Bracey were never good enough anyway.

Malan is showing signs of promise but the cupboard is bare.

Agree with this and Luijack's earlier post - question is why as can't all be down to Ramps and Silvewrwood (despite the middle order shots yesterday)...I honestly can't think of a single English batsmen I wish was out there instead of anyone in our current squad.

Wolfnipplechips 27-12-2021 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystaljim (Post 16177179)
Are you better off with Burns Bairstow opening, Haseeb or Crawley at 3 and Malan at 5? Or Bairstow at 3. If these are your best options, perhaps start to build a batting order around them that works.
Open with 2 experienced guys, one of the kids at 3, then Rooty. Malan can then be more attacking at 5.

Maybe a good call to let Bairstow open. I really donít know. Personally Iíd drop Buttler and let Bairstow keep. Heís then a bloody good option at seven albeit this doesnít solve the top six.:D

Anybody not selected at the moment is becoming a better player by default but not picking Foakes is simply all kinds of wrong.

Maiden Eagle 27-12-2021 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philipw (Post 16176679)
Much though I like the county championship, I think Pietersen has it right on this. Despite always having 17 or 18 teams diluting talent, it has created test batsmen in the past as pretty well all the best overseas players played in it. Potential test players will have played against the best bowlers in the world on a regular basis before even playing a test match. The overseas players no longer need to play in the CC now as they can earn loads more from T20 comps so we are left with just the English players - and not even the test players. In the other countries I think all the domestic talent is concentrated in around six teams and therefore more likely to face higher quality bowling against which to learn your trade.

Good post, this and sadly true about the CC. If there are any overseas players, they are literally playing for a very short time ie R Ashwin played ONE CC game for Surrey, last Summer - That would only be for his benefit, as he prepared for the India tour of England.

Everything seems wrong about the structure of Cricket in England - like when England played the First Test against NZ in June, without a number of rested players, who would be tired after playing in the IPL:wallbash:

Olympian2 27-12-2021 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maiden Eagle (Post 16177232)
Good post, this and sadly true about the CC. If there are any overseas players, they are literally playing for a very short time ie R Ashwin played ONE CC game for Surrey, last Summer - That would only be for his benefit, as he prepared for the India tour of England.

Everything seems wrong about the structure of Cricket in England - like when England played the First Test against NZ in June, without a number of rested players, who would be tired after playing in the IPL:wallbash:

Nail on head.

When the England Assistant Coach says that he hopes that The Hundred will allow the Test batsmen to 'free up and enjoy their cricket, help them to relax. Free up the hands and the arms but [while] being able to adapt to each form of the game', you know the strategy is completely ****ed.

It's no surprise that England have been completely dicked this series. The only (possible) surprise is quite how lamentable they have been.

LuieJack 27-12-2021 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfnipplechips (Post 16177165)
A number of our batters have regressed. Iím not sure having Ramprakash coaching them was ever going to be the right move.

Pope, Crawley and dare I say it Burns have struggled, Bairstow, Buttler and others such as Hameed, Duckett and Bracey were never good enough anyway.

Malan is showing signs of promise but the cupboard is bare.

The problem and we both agree on this is that the cupboard really is bare and has been for some time, and unfortunately we are now seeing the effects of that when playing against better opposition, sadly the players we thought were good are now getting shown up.
Most realise it now needs a complete overhaul if we are to compete against the best Test sides again, and many years ago i suggested appointing Tom Moody as coach which may have put the right "set up" in place to build on. Then 3 years ago when changes were happening i suggested Gillespie should be appointed, and i dont see why we dont try again to tempt him to bring his proven firm/gritty style coaching to the table it is whats needed now moving forward, but we know it will be Collingwood taking over from Silverwood.
As for the rest of this tour and we know its a lost cause now, so i would like to see the selectors stop all the chopping and changing and stick with the younger players for the remaining Tests hopefully allowing them to learn how to face tough opposition and extreme circumstances and see how they cope and it may even teach them lessons. And that could prove to be a long term blessing one way or another in their development, what have we to lose at this stage? so stay with Hameed, Crawley and Pope and hope they learn from it.

crystaljim 27-12-2021 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfnipplechips (Post 16177184)
Maybe a good call to let Bairstow open. I really donít know. Personally Iíd drop Buttler and let Bairstow keep. Heís then a bloody good option at seven albeit this doesnít solve the top six.:D

Anybody not selected at the moment is becoming a better player by default but not picking Foakes is simply all kinds of wrong.

It's the top 6 you got to fix though. Fix the top 6 and Butler come in at 7 and be Butler.

Prince Phillip 27-12-2021 08:58 PM

Did Baron Von Bunghole get banned or is he currently on his long run for when the urn is retained?

RazorsEdge 27-12-2021 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince Phillip (Post 16177337)
Did Baron Von Bunghole get banned or is he currently on his long run for when the urn is retained?

He will be back with some bollocks soon. Maybe waiting for us to loose 5-0Ö

Bones14 27-12-2021 10:31 PM

I gotta say boys, as pathetic as you were last night in the 2nd innings, it was a serious joy to watch Jimmy Anderson bowl. How the **** does he still do it? Unbelievable figures, especially for a guy of his age. I don't say this lightly, but the guy is a genuine Legend.


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