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  #82761  
Old 22-07-2021, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Tastism perhaps. But the class message is coming from you ; “socialists may not enjoy culture”.
What is this culture you speak of?
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  #82762  
Old 22-07-2021, 11:23 AM
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What is this culture you speak of?
The Sound of Music ?
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  #82763  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:01 PM
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Some potentially worrying stuff about how long immunity might last post-vaccination starting to come out. For example To view the link you have to Register or Login and To view the link you have to Register or Login

If, and it is a big if, this is true then I would suggest that it makes vaccine passports fairly difficult to introduce in any sort of useful way, and perhaps reinforces some of the vaccine scepticism for young people (from a personal perspective the cost benefit analysis is quite different if you're talking about the difference between lifelong immunity and something up to a year of immunity).

Appreciate that the Guardian article is full of 'mights' and 'maybes' and the other link is Twitter so nothing worth getting too worked up about at the moment.

Last edited by LSEagle; 22-07-2021 at 12:03 PM.
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  #82764  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by LSEagle View Post
Some potentially worrying stuff about how long immunity might last post-vaccination starting to come out. For example To view the link you have to Register or Login and To view the link you have to Register or Login

If, and it is a big if, this is true then I would suggest that it makes vaccine passports fairly difficult to introduce in any sort of useful way, and perhaps reinforces some of the vaccine scepticism for young people (from a personal perspective the cost benefit analysis is quite different if you're talking about the difference between lifelong immunity and something up to a year of immunity).

Appreciate that the Guardian article is full of 'mights' and 'maybes' and the other link is Twitter so nothing worth getting too worked up about at the moment.
It remains remarkable that such things still appear to spook these researchers. As the first line of the article states / stated 'it is expected that antibody levels will drop' and then goes on the make the point that if they continue to drop that immunity will be short-lived. We had the same scaremongering last year following natural infection antibodies yet, as many predicted, they remained at a steady low state in bone marrow with T-Cells primed to reproduced antibodies upon exposure to the virus. Once again we have some (understandable) uncertainty on something presented as an inference that something concerning will happen / is likely to happen when there is probably a better likelihood that it won't.

It is arguable that this pandemic would have been better served by the media had there not been a continuous rush to print some preliminary, uncontextualised utterance or paper before it has had an adequate chance to be properly appraised or discussed.

Last edited by Windsor_Eagle; 22-07-2021 at 12:32 PM.
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  #82765  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Windsor_Eagle View Post
It is arguable that this pandemic would have been better served by the media had there not been a continuous rush to print some preliminary, uncontextualised utterance or paper before it has had an adequate chance to be properly appraised or discussed.
I'd say inarguable and applying to more than just the pandemic.

I'll be honest the stuff from Israel potentially worries me a bit more since it seems to be based on what is actually happening in the data over there rather than the inferences made in the Guardian article. However, it is pretty hard to get a clear handle on (well, unless you have endless hours to do research).
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  #82766  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:27 PM
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  #82767  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by cpfc4evandeva View Post
Massive first world problem but we are due to fly to California in early September, for our honeymoon.

We still really want to go, so are holding out hope that we will be allowed. We've been double jabbed, are happy to take tests before, during and after the trip. Equally, we don't really want to quarantine when we're there, as that seems like a waste of our limited time away.

What are our chances of being allowed to go? 10%? Reading up on it, it seems highly unlikely but that there is the faintest glimmer of possibility.
Sadly very unlikely due to US rules, not ours. Plenty of other places to go to ...
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  #82768  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by LSEagle View Post
I'd say inarguable and applying to more than just the pandemic.

I'll be honest the stuff from Israel potentially worries me a bit more since it seems to be based on what is actually happening in the data over there rather than the inferences made in the Guardian article. However, it is pretty hard to get a clear handle on (well, unless you have endless hours to do research).
I'm going with these two in order to feed my hope...

A study out of Israel finds vaccine effectiveness against susceptibility to infection was 80-88% and that overall vaccine effectiveness against transmission was 88.5%. In short: vaccination reduced both the rate of infection with SARS-CoV-2 AND transmission to household contacts!

To view the link you have to Register or Login


There is a lot of misinformation circulating regarding vaccine efficacy against Delta (B.1.617.2) in Israel. However, now that actual data is out, we are currently looking at:

•90%+ effective against severe disease for < 65+

•80%+ effective against severe disease for 65+

To view the link you have to Register or Login

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  #82769  
Old 22-07-2021, 12:34 PM
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Figures today will be interesting. Below 48,500 and it would be the first drop in the 7 day average for quite some time i think and might suggest that the wave is peaking following the Euro's uptick. Would make the following 7-10 days interesting to see what then happens to numbers with the opening up and relaxation of rules on distancing and masks.
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  #82770  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windsor_Eagle View Post
It remains remarkable that such things still appear to spook these researchers. As the first line of the article states / stated 'it is expected that antibody levels will drop' and then goes on the make the point that if they continue to drop that immunity will be short-lived. We had the same scaremongering last year following natural infection antibodies yet, as many predicted, they remained at a steady low state in bone marrow with T-Cells primed to reproduced antibodies upon exposure to the virus. Once again we have some (understandable) uncertainty on something presented as an inference that something concerning will happen / is likely to happen when there is probably a better likelihood that it won't.

It is arguable that this pandemic would have been better served by the media had there not been a continuous rush to print some preliminary, uncontextualised utterance or paper before it has had an adequate chance to be properly appraised or discussed.
I thought it was old news that people will need to get more vaccine boosters every few months? The bit I dont understand is how that will play into the covid passort - will your passport have an expiry date after x months?
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  #82771  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Simon Sledger View Post
I thought it was old news that people will need to get more vaccine boosters every few months? The bit I dont understand is how that will play into the covid passort - will your passport have an expiry date after x months?
But I think all the booster discussions have talked about only giving to those over age 50?
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  #82772  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatGonzo View Post
Figures today will be interesting. Below 48,500 and it would be the first drop in the 7 day average for quite some time i think and might suggest that the wave is peaking following the Euro's uptick. Would make the following 7-10 days interesting to see what then happens to numbers with the opening up and relaxation of rules on distancing and masks.
That would be nice!
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  #82773  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:48 PM
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But I think all the booster discussions have talked about only giving to those over age 50?
At present yes. Only to those eligible for flu and the age bracket for that this year has dropped down to 50.
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  #82774  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by LSEagle View Post
But I think all the booster discussions have talked about only giving to those over age 50?

No chance it will stay at just old gits like me. But yes maybe they have just mentioned the over 50s for now - but from a money point of view, might as well keep giving it to every man women and child surely, and say it will protect against new variants? And from a health view - why would they only keep protecting the elderly and not others who have had to get the 2 jabs?
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  #82775  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reps AJ View Post
I'm going with these two in order to feed my hope...

A study out of Israel finds vaccine effectiveness against susceptibility to infection was 80-88% and that overall vaccine effectiveness against transmission was 88.5%. In short: vaccination reduced both the rate of infection with SARS-CoV-2 AND transmission to household contacts!

To view the link you have to Register or Login


There is a lot of misinformation circulating regarding vaccine efficacy against Delta (B.1.617.2) in Israel. However, now that actual data is out, we are currently looking at:

•90%+ effective against severe disease for < 65+

•80%+ effective against severe disease for 65+

To view the link you have to Register or Login

Same account had a tweet dismissing the drop of vaccine efficiency
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  #82776  
Old 22-07-2021, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Sledger View Post
No chance it will stay at just old gits like me. But yes maybe they have just mentioned the over 50s for now - but from a money point of view, might as well keep giving it to every man women and child surely, and say it will protect against new variants? And from a health view - why would they only keep protecting the elderly and not others who have had to get the 2 jabs?
Vaccinating the whole country every year would be a pretty mammoth undertaking, and I wonder what the take-up would look like in five years time (unless the passport is introduced).
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  #82777  
Old 22-07-2021, 02:08 PM
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Vaccinating the whole country every year would be a pretty mammoth undertaking, and I wonder what the take-up would look like in five years time (unless the passport is introduced).
Its not that much bigger than the undertaking being asked of for boosters this year.

Over 90% uptake in those cohorts of around 32m people so you would be looking at delivering close to 30m vaccinations.

The rest of the adult population is about 21m people but uptake in those groups is closer to 70% I think.

That would equate to a 50% increase in the number of vaccinations needed for all adults compared to the current plan of Over 50 and at risk.

Last edited by GreatGonzo; 22-07-2021 at 02:30 PM.
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  #82778  
Old 22-07-2021, 02:20 PM
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Vaccinating the whole country every year would be a pretty mammoth undertaking, and I wonder what the take-up would look like in five years time (unless the passport is introduced).
Like you say, the passport will be key. If the passport remains, and once its rolled out it won't be rolled back imo, then the uptake will remain very high as people want to live and enjoy life.
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  #82779  
Old 22-07-2021, 02:48 PM
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Sadly very unlikely due to US rules, not ours. Plenty of other places to go to ...
Not Italy. Who currently have a 5 day quarantine and where I am due to go in September. The existing rules expire on 31 July so just waiting to see what the new rules say before cancelling.
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Old 22-07-2021, 02:59 PM
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Not Italy. Who currently have a 5 day quarantine and where I am due to go in September. The existing rules expire on 31 July so just waiting to see what the new rules say before cancelling.
I've booked a road trip to Italy for October. Have until end of September to cancel.

Did a road trip to Spain last October (which obviously includes France) - it was much easier then than now! Although I did have to quarantine for 2 weeks when I got back to the UK- which wasn't really a problem.
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